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If You Want an Election and Not a Coronation You Must Act Today

by: philgoblue

Wed Nov 07, 2007 at 13:38:39 PM EST


No matter what happened in an Ingham County Circuit Court, the decision for a 15 January "Primary" and a 9 February Caucus will still be made tonight at 7:00 pm during the Michigan Democratic Party Executive Committee meeting in Lansing.

Let's face it, this farce should be stopped by Democrats, not by journalist and a list broker in court.
And make no mistake about it the Hillary-backers that have hijacked the attempt to move up still want to trade your right to vote so that Hillary can make some national news with a "win in a Michigan primary" after a loss in Iowa.  That's all this is about, them sacrificing Michigan Democrats for a news story for Hillary Clinton.

The Michigan Democratic Party Executive Board is meeting TONIGHT Wednesday, 7 November at 7:00 p.m to discuss and possibly vote on the 15 January primary opt-out (going back to a DNC-sanctioned primary where Edwards will happily campaign in Michigan and be on the ballot).

If you want to be heard, you must call now. The receptionist at the MDP is taking a tally.

Call the MDP: (517) 371-5410

philgoblue :: If You Want an Election and Not a Coronation You Must Act Today
Tell them:

"I want Chairman Brewer to opt-out of the 15 January beauty contest and go to a DNC-sanctioned primary where candidates will campaign, Michigan Democrats can vote for who they want to vote for, and our votes can actually choose delegates to the National Convention.  Please tell him and the entire Executive Committee that I want to vote for who I want to vote for, I want to vote for actual delegates, I want to have an election where the candidates actually campaign here so Michigan's issues can be heard, I want a 9 February caucus."

If that is too long, just say:

"I'm against the 15 January primary/beauty contest.  I'm for a 9 February caucus with all the candidates.  Please tell Chairman Brewer and the Executive Committee.  Thanks, bye."

CALL RIGHT NOW!  It'll only take 30 seconds and it will protect your right to vote in a meaningful primary.

I've talked with the powers that be and John Edwards Wants To Campaign In and Win Michigan.
If you want John to be President, you need to call the MDP NOW (it'll just take 30 seconds -- don't put it off any longer).

If you wish to email: midemparty@michigandems.com

Hi, my name is _____________ and I (live in _______________. I am writing this email because I am concerned that I will not be able to vote for my candidate of choice in the 2008 Michigan Primary, currently scheduled for January 15, 2008. Many Democratic voters of Michigan are not being given the choice to vote for the candidate they prefer in this very important nominating process. Due to this, we are feeling disenfranchised.

A February 9th caucus not only conforms with the rules set forth by the Democratic National Committee, it will allow Michigan?s issues to be confronted by all of the candidates and will give all of the citizens of Michigan a fair say in selecting the next Democratic presidential nominee. For a democracy to work, all citizens must be included.

I am hoping that the Michigan Democratic Party will see the importance of a ballot comprised of all of the candidates and reinstate our caucus for February 9, 2008.

Sincerely,

Name
Phone Number
Email address

But, a quick phone call to the MDP is better: (517) 371-5410

You can also go out in front of the building and demonstrate.  
The MDP Headquarters
606 Townsend, Lansing, MI 48933 (map)

My favorite homemade signs:
  No to the 15 January Beauty Contest!
  Don't Play Around with My Right to Vote
  Follow the Rules -- 9 February Caucus!
  We Want a Real Election, Not a Fake Coronation
  Yes to a 9 February DNC-Sanctioned Caucus
  I Want to Vote for Who I Want to Vote

Here's more information on the Primary/Caucus Issue:

The Legal Remedy

Mark Brewer can simply "opt-out" of the 15 January "primary" and take us back to a caucus on a DNC-sanctioned date:'

According to the Michigan Election Law 

168.613a (2) Not later than 4 p.m. on November 14, 2007, the chairperson of each participating political party shall notify the secretary of state if his or her political party will be using a method other than the results of the January 15, 2008 presidential primary to select delegates to his or her respective national convention to nominate a candidate for president of the United States in 2008. 

Please, Chairman Brewer, take the reins and save our beloved Michigan Democratic Party, allow Michigan Democrats to vote for who they want.  Allow Michigan Democrats the ability to choose real delegates.  Don't allow the farce which will have terrible consequences for our Party -- disgruntled activists, angry and confused voters, and Republicans who can say national Democrats don't care about Michigan.

The Anti-15 January Coronation Movement Is Growing

In the State Capital

Two weeks ago State Representative Martin Griffin (D-Jackson, District 64) but forward a bill -- House Bill 5353 -- in the Michigan House to scrap the 15 January "primary."  

Mlive's report of the Griffin bill: 

State Rep. Martin Griffin, D-Jackson, is pushing legislation that would effectively cancel the state's 2008 presidential primary.
He says the state can't afford a $10 million primary that no longer makes Michigan relevant in the Democratic process. ...
"In these tough economic times, taxpayers can ill afford to bear the cost of a presidential primary," he said. "The benefit to holding the primary is lost."

Griffin's bill has been co-sponsored by out of 58 Democrats as co-sponsors as of 25 October.
  Marc Corriveau (D-20, Wayne County)
  Barb Byrum (D-67, Ingham County)
  Mary Valentine (D-91, Muskegon County)
  Kate Ebli (D-56, Monroe County)
  Ed Clemente (D-14, WayneCounty)
  Terry Brown (D-48, Huron and Tuscola Counties)
  Mark Meadows (D-69, Ingham County)
  Paul Condino (D-35, Oakland County)
  Steven Lindberg (D-109, Alger, Luce and Marquette Counties)
  Marie Donigan (D-26, Oakland County)
  Mike Simpson (D-65, Eaton, Jackson and Lenawee Counties)
  Bert Johnson (D-5, Wayne County)
  Coleman Young Jr. (D-4, Wayne County)
  Richard LeBlanc (D-18, Wayne County)
  Doug Bennett (D-92, Muskegon County)
  Fred Miller (D-31, Macomb County)
  Steve Tobocman (D-12, Wayne County)
  Robert Dean (D-75, Kent County)

In the Counties

Several County Democratic Parties have passed resolutions against the 15 January Primary, those include key Democratic counties like Kent (Grand Rapids), Macomb and Washtenaw (Ann Arbor):

Kent County Democratic Party

Resolved: The Kent County Democratic Party believes that a 15 January primary that chooses no National Convention delegates and gives Michigan voters a very limited choice from the Democratic presidential field is not in the interest of Michigan or the Michigan Democratic Party.

Therefore, the Kent County Democratic Party strongly encourages the Michigan Democratic Party and its Chair Mark Brewer to opt out of the 15 January primary and return to a DNC-sanctioned Caucus on or after 5 February 2008.

Washtenaw County Democratic Party

We applaud the efforts of our state Democratic leaders, particularly Debbie Dingell, Sen. Levin, and Gov. Granholm, to seek more balanced and representative participation by all states in the process of primaries and selection of the Democratic Party's candidate for president.  However, in view of the limited number of choices now to be available to voters on the proposed January 15 Democratic primary ballot, and unless all eligible candidates can be put on the January 15th primary ballot, and because of our commitment to an equal-opportunity democratic process, we the officers' board of the Washtenaw Democratic Party wish to inform MDP Chair Mark Brewer, the MDP executive committee, and the other party leaders of our strong support for a return to the use of caucuses, either on February 9 or on one of the earlier dates (December 8, 2007; December 15, 2007; January 5, 2008, or January 12, 2008) previously listed by Party leaders to challenge any move by New Hampshire to schedule its primary earlier than January 22, 2008.  Further, we will communicate to all county Democratic chairs and Congressional district chairs throughout Michigan, urging them to express support for this resolution.

I don't have a copy of the Macomb resolution.  I've heard of resolutions passed at the 10th and 12th District Parties, but haven't seen them.  I've heard of other resolutions, but haven't seen them, if you know of any, add them to the list.  I know similar resolutions failed in Ingham and Kalamazoo, but due to "let the leadership decide" arguments rather than support for the 15 January "primary."  I know of no resolutions passed by county parties supporting the 15 January "primary."

A History Lesson

My friend greee, has written an excellent, point by point history and legal study of the Michigan primary debates:

1.  The 2004 Democratic National Convention passed a resolution calling for the creation of the Commission on Presidential Nomination and Scheduling.  This Resolution was co-sponsored by Senator Carl Levin and Michigan Democratic National Committeewoman Debbie Dingell.

2.  The Commission was tasked with the responsibility of studying the timing of Democratic presidential primaries and caucuses and developing appropriate recommendations for the 2008 nominating cycle.

3.  The Commission began work in March of 2005.  It held five hearings on this matter, and received significant input from various state parties.

4.  In its Executive Summary, the Commission acknowledged that one of its purposes was to address the role played by Iowa and New Hampshire in the process of selecting the Democratic Part's nominee for President.  The report acknowledged the "valuable" roles played by Iowa and New Hampshire in the nomination process.  In particular, the Commission identified the as positive "the personal engagement and involvement of the voters who participate in these contests."

5.  The Commission recognized the existence of reform efforts "over the last three decades" that have attempted to broaden participation in the delegate selection process."

6.  The Commission report also related the concern of various state parties that expressed "significant concerns" about the "disproportionate influence" of the Iowa and New Hampshire nominating caucus and primary.  One of the states expressing such concern was Michigan.

7.  One of the stated goals of the Commission was a reaffirmation of the Democratic Party's commitment to a nominating process that [would] produce the best and strongest candidate as a nominee for the office of President of the United States.

8.  One of the stated goals of the Commission was to receive and consider a broad input on the process of selecting a Democratic nominee from a wide range of interested and knowledgeable individuals and organizations. 

9.  To this end, the Commission met with 31 individuals including Senator Carl Levin and Michigan Democratic National Committeewoman Debbie Dingell.  Also, the Commission took written testimony from an additional 14 individuals or organizations well familiar with the presidential primary  process.

10.  The Commission also noted the more current involvement of Michigan in the efforts to reform the nomination process:

"When the DNC adopted its 2004 Delegate Selection Rules in January 2002, Michigan Democratic leaders voiced their opposition, as they had in the past, to the exceptions provided in the rules for Iowa and New Hampshire. Later in 2003, the Michigan State Party indicated that it was its intention to submit a delegate selection plan that scheduled its contest for the same day as the New Hampshire primary. This proposed action engendered a not unexpected reaction from Iowa and New Hampshire and generated intense media attention. Ultimately, following serious discussions between the DNC and Democratic leaders in Michigan, Michigan agreed to hold its 2004 contest inside the window. For its part, the DNC agreed to form a commission to review the rules and make recommendations with respect to the 2008 calendar.  Accordingly, then DNC Chairman McAuliffe, Senator Levin, and Ms. Dingell jointly co-sponsored a resolution adopted by the 2004 Democratic National Convention on July 25, 2004 establishing a "Commission on Presidential Nomination Timing and Scheduling."

11.  Senator Levin and Debbie Dingell appeared at the May 14, 2005 meeting of the Commission held in Chicago, Illinois.  According to the Commission report:

"The comments by the Party leaders from Michigan centered on what they described as the dominating role and privileged position of Iowa and New Hampshire at the start of the nominating process. The leaders asserted that these early contests have a disproportionate impact on the nominating process rendering contests in later states less meaningful or altogether irrelevant. They suggested that the retail politics espoused by Iowa and New Hampshire can be duplicated in other states. It was suggested that both states are able to keep their coveted status based on a strategy of commitments and pledges that the states have exerted on past potential presidential candidates. The actions by other states to move their contests closer to those held in Iowa and New Hampshire suggest that voters in other states are anxious to also have their issues addressed and their voices heard. The Michigan presenters stated that ending the Iowa and New Hampshire exemptions would allow the Party to fulfill its promise and commitment to treat voters and states equally, and would prevent any state from having and  exerting a disproportionate influence over the process."

12.  In its written report,  the Commission states:

"The rules that govern this process are not abstractions unrelated to broader goals. Rather, they are designed, if somewhat imperfectly, to help ensure that the Democratic Party selects its nominees through a fair, open, inclusive and representative process."

13.  In its written report, the Commission stated its concern about the negative impact of "front loading" the nomination process.

14.  As a part of Findings and Recommendations, the Commission recommended that there be one or two first-tier caucuses between the Iowa caucus and the New Hampshire primary.

15.  The recommendation of the Commission was adopted by the Rules and Bylaws Committee and incorporated into the Delegate Selection Rules (hereinafter "DSR") for the 2008 Democratic National Convention.

16.  On April 14, 2006 Michigan Democratic Party Chairman Mark Brewer submitted an application for a "pre-window" caucus slot.  However, this application was rejected.  Instead, two "pre-window" slots were awarded to Nevada and South Carolina.

In other words, Michigan democrats Levin and Dingell sponsored a process, participated in the process, but did not like the results.  So they are taking there toys and going to play elsewhere.

For other diaries on the topic:

David Boyle's passionate MDP *CLOSED-TO-PUBLIC* meeting on 11/7; demand a Feb. caucus & enfranchisement (FURTHER updated)
My earlier: On the Primary Crisis: What's Next, ,
sndowty's Washtenaw Dems Resolution on Jan. 15th Primary
Tom Koller's insightful The Sky is Not Falling (yet)

As David said in his diary:

It's YOUR Party. Do you want your vote to count, and the right to vote for all the 2008 candidates; or do you want some "beauty contest" that even Hillary said doesn't matter, and with most of the major candidates absent?
Your Party, your choice.
Let your voice be heard!!

Tags: , , , (All Tags)
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Ya got one our (4.00 / 2)
I have to see I'm troubled that so few big bloggers at MichLib have taken up this voting rights issue.

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast

God Save the Queen (4.00 / 1)
Phil, please know that I'm paying attention to this issue.  I'm with you all the way to the end.  Which hopefully will be soon.

[ Parent ]
It is so wonderful that you're so transparent (4.00 / 2)
You're essentially for the coronation.  You're willing to harm Michigan, the MDP, and voters because you want to "save the Queen."

Well, my family was here before the Revolution and I'm a Democrat, republican and Patriot and I'm for democracy in Michigan.

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]
Edwards (4.00 / 2)
You may be, but your candidate is not.  He dropped out of Michigan.  He gave up on our state.  Please see the Granholm endorsement.

[ Parent ]
You couldn't be more wrong (4.00 / 1)
(though I suspect you'll try later on).

Edwards wants to campaign in Michigan.  Edwards wants to win Michigan.  He wants to win in a real election, choosing real delegates after a real campaign.  Not a no campaign-no delegates coronation.

Besides, now that the 15 January Primary is unconstitutional, nobody is on the ballot since there is no ballot and the Pledge not to campaign in Michigan is null and void (unless the Hillaryites and Levin and the Republicans throw away our right to a real election by going back to a non-DNC sanctioned date).

And you might want to be warry of playing the endorsement game.  One, that was about the weakest endorsement I think I've ever seen (Friday at 4:30 pm?).  Two, watch out for the UAW!

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]
I remeber that endorsement (4.00 / 1)
If she has picked the wrong horse in this race she will regret those words. 

[ Parent ]
Voting rights... (4.00 / 1)
Well, you know, this is a complicated issue.

On one hand, I'm not a member of the Democratic Party and don't ever intend to join.  So, I don't really see it as my place to tell the party how to choose its presidential nominee.

On the other, the presidential primary bill grossly subverted the public good to the best interests of the party, which is obviously wrong.

On the third hand, Michigan should move ahead in the primary schedule.  Much as I like the tradition of Iowa and New Hampshire (I went to Iowa in '92 to see the caucuses in person), neither of them ultimately has the impact that they're made out to be.  I'm also biased in favor of Michigan, because I happen to live here.  So, I'd like to see Michigan positioned better.

On the fourth hand, what really concerns me more than anything is how early the process got started this year.  It's not that I'm already fatigued, but that the nomination appears to me to be less and less a contest as it drags on.  A couple of months ago, if ballots were being cast, it might have been a contest.  These days, it appears that Hillary has been able to put a more solid lock on the nomination ... before a vote has even been cast.  In short, I'm more concerned that getting this thing started so damned early is going to make state contests themselves irrelevant than I am with whether Michigan goes on Jan. 15 with a primary or Feb. 5 with a caucus.

Among the Trees


[ Parent ]
Reply to #3 (4.00 / 1)
But, Michigan isn't moving ahead with a primary.  Its moving ahead with a meaningless beauty contest with no campaigning and one candidate.  Michigan issues aren't being addressed at all -- the exact opposite of what the original movement was meant to bring (which I supported FYI).

The only way to get reform is to have a referee and can enforse a calendar.  If Michigan breaks the rules and is rewarded, that'll just encoruage everyone to break the rules next time.  If Michigan breaks the rules and is punished, then that'll create a referee system (and you can be sure that referee won't think to kindly on us in 2012).  If Michigan does the right thing and goes back to the rules, then that'll also create a referee system.

Then with a strong DNC we can lobby for reform and more of a Michigan say next time around.

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]
Picking and choosing... (4.00 / 2)
You asked why more big bloggers here hadn't taken up this voting rights issue.  So, I posted why.

Michigan's Democratic Party is moving forward with a meaningless beauty contest that will ultimately be paid for with money from the state's general fund.  We agree on this.

But, the entire issue isn't so clearcut to me, considering that the intentions behind the thing.  Anyway, I'm not a member of the Democratic Party and will never be, so if I were someone in the Party hierarchy, I wouldn't take my opinion on how to nominate a candidate very seriously.

Among the Trees


[ Parent ]
Eric (4.00 / 3)
my two cents, into today's deflated dollar:

Prior to the time the primary bill was signed by Granholm, all of the dems had signed a pledge to neither campaign nor participate in any delegate selection event not sanctioned by the DNC.  Very clearly, any decision to remain on the ballot for a 1/15 primary constitutes "participation".  With the withdrawal of four of the candidates, approximately 40% of potential dem primary voters in Michigan have been effectively disenfranchised.  Thus, it is now a voting rights issue.

I did not care much for Harris in Florida in 2000; I did not care much for Blackwell in Ohio in 2004.  And I do not like the dem party pulling shenanigans with my 2008 primary/caucus vote.


[ Parent ]
Party primary vs. public election (4.00 / 1)
Harris in 2000 and Blackwell in 2004 are cases where public elections were called into question.  The Michigan Democratic Party is responsible for nominating its own candidate.

This is one of the reasons why I'm so opposed to paying for the primary with state general fund dollars.  The party, and probably the candidates, should be paying for it.

Among the Trees


[ Parent ]
Thanks (4.00 / 1)
I'm just disagreeing with your opinion.

I also don't think we're heading to a non-DNC-sanctioned primary.

From what I hear, cooler heads will prevail and well have a DNC-sanctioned caucus sometime between 25 January and 7 February (with a January date being OKed by the DNC so Levin and Granholm can save some face).

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]
Eric (4.00 / 1)
One of the things the DNC was greatly concerned about as it struggled to come up with its 2008 delegate selection plan was the trend towards front loading.  Many of us believe the front loading process rewards fund raising as opposed to the actual process of persuading voters.

I have read before where you state that you believe that the effect of Iowa and New Hampshire is over stated.  Chris Bowers (as I recall) has done an analysis showing a rather significant bump.  If you have not seen it, I'll try to find it for you.


[ Parent ]
Bump... (4.00 / 1)
The thing about bumps is that when you get over them, you go right back to where you were.  Howard Dean, Tom Harkin, Paul Tsongas, John McCain ... these were all candidates who did well in early primaries and caucuses but ultimately found that an early bump didn't really change things all that much.

I say this considering how early things got started for next year.  I mean, what benefit is there to be had by winning in New Hampshire except to raise your name recognition and give the impression that people like you well enough to vote for you.  We've been exposed to these people on television and the Internets for the better part of a year now (how many debates have there been?).  It's no longer necessary to take our cues from Iowa and New Hampshire, and it won't be necessary for anyone to take their cues from Michigan (we'd benefit from increased exposure and campaign dollars, but we probably wouldn't influence many people one way or the other).

Among the Trees


[ Parent ]
Sure, we've been exposed (4.00 / 1)
and so have other junkies.  But most Democrats are in the "I like all three" place right now and folks are just used to not paying attention until Iowa thins it out.

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast

[ Parent ]
Bowers analysis is (4.00 / 1)
here, for what it is worth.  http://openleft.com/...

You certainly have a point about Harkin and Iowa in 1992, and Tsongas and New Hampshire in the same year.

McCain skipped Iowa in 2000 and Dean did not win Iowa in '04.


[ Parent ]
McCain and Dean (4.00 / 3)
I don't think you can number crunch your way to an answer on this.  Organization is more important in many respects than poll numbers.  Hillary has both.  Organization is also what got George McGovern the nomination in '72.

That's especially true in small contests like Iowa and New Hampshire.  I mean, Tom Harkin wins Iowa in 1992?  You coulda blown me over with a feather... Howard Dean wins New Hampshire in 2004?  Get out of town.

So McCain skips Iowa in '00, and concentrates on New Hampshire.  He does well, builds momentum and hype, gets clobbered in South Carolina and it's all over but the hugging.  The hype is a media creation, but what's important -- organization -- is something entirely internal.

Among the Trees


[ Parent ]
Obama (4.00 / 1)
I wouldn't be so sure Hillary has a lock on the nomination.  I still expect to see Obama give Hillary a tough fight and even possibly overtake her.  Giving Hillary a tough race would prove to a lot of people, including me, that he has what it takes to beat a Republican in the fall.

[ Parent ]
MDP phone PRIVATE meeting? (4.00 / 1)
  Didn't Brewer say a few days ago (DetNews? link not handy) that the MDP might have a meeting by phone (!) sometime after today?
  So, Debbie, Mark, and Carl can sell out all your rights in private. Rank-and-file Dems, you are so lucky...

Link? (4.00 / 1)
I disagree that Mark Brewer isn't on the side of the rank-and-file Democrats (at least we don't see that yet).

It could be that the agenda was changed because Brewer didn't have the execcom votes yet to go back to 9 February.

For now, everyone call back and ask for a DNC-sanctioned caucus on or after 5 February.

If the caucus is before then, we're back in the same situation: no campaigning, no delegates, one-candidate coronation.

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]
That is the link to the story David mentioned. (4.00 / 1)


[ Parent ]
Thx (0.00 / 0)
  &, check the "slapfight" diary for northernlib's mental illness implied accusation of you (!!).

[ Parent ]
Thanx for the heads up (4.00 / 2)
and a good laugh.  He reminds me a bit of that joker "holden caulfied" on MyDD.

[ Parent ]
That should be "she" not "he" (0.00 / 0)
That should be "she reminds me a bit of that joker 'holden caulfied" on MyDD. (sic)"

And you boys need to have a sense of humor and the ability to take a bit of ribbing. 


[ Parent ]
Rank and File Democrats (0.00 / 0)
Phil, you don't represent the interests of rank and file Democrats.  Take a look at every independent poll of likely Democratic primary voters over the past year.  They all say the same thing.  Take a look at the Democrats in the Michigan Legislature.  Only 1/3 of them co-sponsored legislation supporting a later caucus.  The Democratic controlled House passed the legislation allowing a for the January 15 primary.  In a democracy, the majority rules, not those who whine the loudest.

[ Parent ]
Based upon what I know of Phil's efforts (4.00 / 2)
on the west side of the state, I can say he is working for the interests of at least some rank and file democrats.  And he has gotten a great response to his efforts.  For example:

1.  He successfully pushed for and organized an appearance by Elizabeth Edwards;

2.  He introduced a resolution passed by the Kent County dems calling for a Feb. 9 caucus;

3.  He organized an Edwards presence in the GR Labor day parade.  25 people turned out to march, and we manned a tent following that parade.  Scores of people showed up to chat with us, take bumper stickers and lapel pins and otherwise show support for Edwards;

4.  He is a well respected blogger on Kos, and most of his diaries wind up on the rec list;

5.  He was involved with the recent efforts to get people to call into the MDP to oppose the 1/15 primary.

This is only a partial list.  Phil would never claim to "represent" rank and file; but he does work for them.


[ Parent ]
Dammit greee (4.00 / 1)
You forgot that I formed GR Drinking Liberally -- my greatest achievement.
http://drinkingliber...

Oh, and being the online guy for David LaGrand -- I'm still high from that win.

Oh, and helping to grow the West Michigan blog DemocraticEdge!  http://www.democrati...

Toot Toot!


West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]
PS (4.00 / 1)
When the hell are you going to recommend my damn diary?!

It's easier no with even more Soapblox fun!

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]
Rec or Troll rate? (4.00 / 1)


[ Parent ]
Congratulations (0.00 / 0)
I can't believe they're going to "disenfranchise" you after all the kind and respectful statements you've made about the leadership of the MDP.  You must be on very good terms with Mrs. Dingell and Senator Levin if you're close enough to them to call them by their given names.

[ Parent ]
Your comment implies (4.00 / 2)
that disenfranchisement is an appropriate reaction to dissent and, as you seem to state, the "disrespectful" nature of referring to a politician by his/her first name.

Good grief, Charlene Brown.

I didn't know Nixon, but he will always be "Tricky Dick" to me.  I don't know Clinton, but he will always be "Bubba" or the "Big Dog" to me.  I don't know Bush, but he will always be "The Pinhead" to me.


[ Parent ]
Dissent vs. Being a Jerk (2.50 / 2)
There is a big difference between dissent and acting like a jerk.  Dissent will earn you respect, even from your adversaries.  Acting like a jerk will get you thrown out of the room and perhaps even tased.

[ Parent ]
Thank you Charlene (4.00 / 1)


[ Parent ]
How can Debbie Dingell (3.00 / 3)
say this with a straight face?

Debbie Dingell, a Democratic power broker who helped lead the push for a Jan. 15 primary, said late Wednesday that the Michigan primary on Jan. 15 "is going to ... ensure that a maximum number of people from Michigan are able to participate in selecting the next president."

How is a primary with one candidate, no campaigning, and no delegates going to accomlish that Mrs. Dingell?

It's clear now that this has nothing to do at all with primary calendar reform, this is nothing but an attempt to abuse Michigan so that Hillary can have a news story about a win after she losses Iowa.  That's what your right to vote has been sacrificed for.

It's a complete farce.

Apparently, this is the only way the Michigan Hillaryites think Hillary can win our state.

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


According to your logic (4.00 / 2)
Hillary was the one who convinced the other Democratic nominees to take their names off of the ballot, right???

[ Parent ]
All candidates signed a pledge (4.00 / 1)
not to "participate" in a primary by a state that has broken DNC rules and gone inside the DNC-sanctioned 5 February window.  All the candidates except for Hillary and Dodd know what the definition of "participate" is.


West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast

[ Parent ]
Go Cry (4.00 / 2)
Go cry to the voters in Iowa and New Hamsphire and see if they care.  Most Michigan voters and Florida voters don't give a damn about the value of some pledge that discriminates against our state and other states who don't insist on going first all the time.

[ Parent ]
I want a president that will (4.00 / 1)
live up to his or her word.

I don't want a president who breaks it and I don't want a president who reinterprets what they sign with "signing statements."

We went through a process with the DNC that Levin himself initiated, we should live within the rules we've helped set.  Not act like toddlers who didn't get their way.

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]
Their decision (4.00 / 2)
They made their beds, now its time for them to lie in it.

The pledge "not to campaign" had nothing to do with Obama/Edwards/Richardson VOLUNTARILY taking their names off of the ballot. If Hillary and Dodd were the only one's not stupid enough to shoot themselves in the foot.....


[ Parent ]
Get your facts straight (4.00 / 2)
the pledge included two operative words: campaign and participate.  Not just campaign, as you state in your post.

[ Parent ]
The Full Pledge and Link (4.00 / 1)
Four State Pledge Letter 2008
Iowa, New Hampshire, Nevada, South Carolina
August 31, 2007

WHEREAS, over a year ago, the Democratic National Committee established a 2008 nominating calendar;

WHEREAS, this calendar honors the racial, ethnic, economic and geographic diversity of our party and our country;

WHEREAS, the DNC also honored the traditional role of retail politics early in the nominating process, to ensure that money alone will not determine our presidential nominee;

WHEREAS, it is the desire of Presidential campaigns, the DNC, the states and the American people to bring finality, predictability and common sense to the nominating calendar.

THEREFORE, I _______________, Democratic Candidate for President, pledge I shall not campaign or participate in any state which schedules a presidential election primary or caucus before Feb. 5, 2008, except for the states of Iowa, Nevada, New Hampshire and South Carolina, as "campaigning" is defined by the rules and regulations of the DNC. It does not include activities specifically related to raising campaign resources such as fundraising events or the hiring of fundraising staff.

http://www.nhdp.org/...

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]
Having (presumably) reviewed the text of the actual pledge (4.00 / 1)
would you like to revise your comment to something like, of say, "If Hillary and Dodd were the only one's sleazy enough not to live up to their pledge. . . ."

[ Parent ]
January 15 Primary is a Go (0.00 / 0)
The House and Senate have agreed on a fix of the January 14 primary law pursuant to yesterday's court decision.  The Senate will take up the fix at 3 p.m. this afternoon.  The House will follow either today or Tuesday.  The MDP is expected to approve the primary and the MRP will follow suit.  The end of this silly debate is in sight.

Confirmed in Part (0.00 / 0)
News above is now being confirmed in part (not the MDP part yet) at www.mirsnews.com for those with a subscription.

Question for MichLib:  How much of copyrighted sources like MIRS or Gongwer are we allowed to re-post here?


[ Parent ]
Sad that the forces of Coronation (4.00 / 1)
are in league with Bishop and the Republican Leadership in the Senate.

Michigan Democrats in the Senate and House: Vote No on a 15 January Primary bill that gives Michigan no voice, no campaigns, one candidate, no delegates, no voter roles, and leads to a chaotic situation where primary calendar reform will fail and leads to angry activists and Democratic voters!

We're better off with a DNC-sanctioned caucus

Don't follow the Republicans off the cliff.  They're not interested in helping us.  There interested in not being term-limited and winning a general election for president and taking back the State House.

West Michigan Rising: The Progressive Blog for Our (future) Left Coast


[ Parent ]

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